@GreatGrumbledook Have you nobody to speak with? I thought this was a place for music and nothing else.Debate can you do in another place.

I love this.

@prince2000ful: I guess any comment section is for debate in its very being; as discussion is the logical result of making comments and as I did make my rather playful statement about the music of Bach and its role in excusing Christendom I think it is not amiss to defend it against objections and pleas. So if people chose to debate with me here I will not shun them and you can listen to the music without reading the comments.

Of course people were great lovers of Liberty when they didn´t hav any. In those times it was the church which was ruling and peoples life were by no dout a hell. A struggle for surviving.
So what could the church do? give the people
music to listen to and demands of how to live.
This has absolutely nothing to do about freedom.
Freedom to think and to act like any human beeing is quite another matter.I will you give another music to listen to. Find Teresa Zylis-Gara and listen (Moniuszko)

Sorry, I prefer Karl Richter 1980, Münchner Bach-Orchester and Bach-Chor

@prince2000ful: History is not your coup of tea, is it? Read some medieval texts and find out the no one considered life as hell there; the Church was held in much less absolute believe than are the doctors and scientists are today! The existence of God and the Devil and the anticipation Dooms Day was the same as our beliefs in natural laws and the climate change. Read the trial files of Jeanne dArc and find out how little a village girl was ruled by the priests. …

@prince2000ful: And I cannot spare you the now mandatory Hegel quote concerning the development of the awareness about liberty as the very essence of the human spirit in history:

“The Orientals have not attained the knowledge that Spirit – Man as such – is free; and because they do not know this they are not free. They only know that one is free. But on this very account, the freedom of that one is only caprice; ferocity – brutal recklessness or passion, or a mildness and tameness of the …

… desires, which is itself only an accident of Nature – mere caprice like the former. – That one is therefore only a Despot; not a free man. The consciousness of Freedom first arose among the Greeks, and therefore they were free; but they, and the Romans likewise, knew only that some are free, – not man as such. Even Plato and Aristotle did not know this. The Greeks, therefore, had slaves; and their whole life and the maintenance of their splendid liberty, was implicated with the …

… institution of slavery: a fact moreover, which made that liberty on the one hand only an accidental, transient and limited growth; on the other hand, constituted it a rigorous thraldom of our common nature – of the Human. The Germanic nations, under the influence of Christianity, were the first to attain the consciousness, that man, as man, is free: that it is the freedom of Spirit which constitutes its essence. This consciousness arose first in religion, the inmost region of Spirit; …

… but to introduce the principle into the various relations of the actual world, involves a more extensive problem than its simple implantation; a problem whose solution and application require a severe and lengthened process of culture.”